I refer to the interview of Dr Lim Keng yaik published in Malaysiakini today. I will qoute part of the interview on Lee Kah Choon in Malaysiakini for the benefit of those not subscribing to it:
Lee sparked controversy last week when he was appointed by Penang Chief Minister Lim Guan Eng as a director for the state’s investment arm – Penang Development Corporation (PDC) and InvestPenang.
He subsequently withdrew from the party after being issued a show cause letter from Gerakan acting president Dr Koh Tsu Koon.
Keng Yaik said that party leders would have most probably agreed with Lee to take up the post if they were informed first about it.
“If he had the brevity to discuss with the party leadership, they would (have) most probably agreed with him to take up the post.
“If he had briefed us, we would have had a hard time seeing this so-called new paradigm shift as espoused by the ‘great’ Guan Eng,” he said.
So finally the truth has come out. Lee Kah Choon ‘s fault, if you can call that a fault, is not informing the party leadership first. If Lee has informed the party first, it would be OK. That is from Dr Lim KY.
So why call Lee all sort of names and by doing that, spoilt the name of Gerakan and the goodwill that such a move would have generated and the gain of support from Penang people.?Pls refer to the press statement I have made to understand the circumstances at that time.
Lee was only an ordinary member at that time. He has resigned all his positions within the party and by doing so, is no longer involved in the decision making process of party Gerakan. there would not have been any policy clash.
Do you need every Gerakan member to inform the party Central about taking up a position or a job? To me, that is not logical.
If the party wishes to reform , it has to place the people interest above self or even party’s.
For those who have not read this pst ,pls read this post which has received a few thousands hits on the first day of its publication: The ball is now at Gerakan’s foot and the press statements from a group of us.
Dr. Hsu's forum 
May 01, 2008 @ 14:48:12
After his comment…Lim Keng Yiak was asked to resign as Gerakan adviser by his party.. top brass men.
Lim Keng Yiak is a brave…cunning and witty man. He talks and behave like a gangster chief…and usually gangster chief…go straight to the point.
Gangsters chief are considered by uneducated Chinese .as a hero…like Robin Hood…really mean…. ‘Rob…the Hoodlum’ in English….and hoodlum is meaning…gangster..in fine English language. He robs the rich and feed the poor…that’s Robin Hood.
So…do Lim Keng Yiak…talked all that like a gangster chief…..for the good .for all poor Malaysians? For that matter….did he talk any or everything good for poor helpless Malaysians?
NO..NO…NO
So to give the tittle….as gangster chief to Lim and Samy Vellu…..are insults to the real gangster chiefs.. ..with noble hearts…like the movie..’Braveheart” gangster chief and of course … Robin Hood.
Lim Keng Yiak is a very very cunning …low class…selfish man. that’s why his member is asking him to resign and shut up. Gerakan is dying…and Lim is doing nothing good to help…except showing off….like he always do.
It’s all coming out…again thanks to People’s Party… winning democracy.. to now let Malaysians see so much weird characters….each fighting for their own survivals.
But I do miss this clown in BN. At least he got some guts..to tell UMNO off….once awhile.
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May 01, 2008 @ 15:32:25
From what Lim Keng Yaik has said, it seems LKY, KTK and the Gerakan Central Committee expect all Gerakan to sign over their lives to the party when they sign up as party members.
This is a laughable attitude, to say the least!
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May 01, 2008 @ 15:34:05
sorry, mean to say ‘..all Gerakan members to sign…”
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May 01, 2008 @ 15:37:53
novice…you are smart … witty..and right.!
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May 01, 2008 @ 15:54:40
monsterball, thank you. But am only trying to provide some check and balance.
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May 01, 2008 @ 16:06:33
When there is food,drinks and comfort,we stay together. When the house is leaking,not enough food and drinks to go around, let’s leave the house now. Is that the kind of friend and member you want? Don’t be a hypocrite. Don’t use the name of serving the public as an excuse. Sick of politicians who are not brave enough to admit that their actual intention is to look for position.Lim Guan Eng(through Jeff ooi) stated clearly the DAP want to create earthquake for Gerakan;not a so called new political culture. Please all of you wake up to the real motives of DAP.
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May 01, 2008 @ 16:11:04
Lim Guan Eng has succeeded to divide Gerakan which may perish in no time if some members still believe in the “kind” heart of Lim Guan Eng. They tried to do a similar “Lee Kah Choon” in Perak but failed. Gerakan members, don’t be a fool.DAP are out to kill you;don’t be naive.
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May 01, 2008 @ 16:19:45
The next one to chop will be you doc, I can bet.
No one has pointed out his mistakes the way you have done. You think this person whom chua soi lek called 2 face person will tolerate? I have follow for many years, you either fall in line or out.
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May 01, 2008 @ 16:29:06
I am just a grassroot and nobody. I will stick out my neck for the chop……no fear.
I am just speaking the truth and trying to show leaders another view of certain matter. Because as a person with no personal interest except to speak out the truth, I see things very differently from those leaders at the top who have been somebody before…. either involved in BN decision making or governments…..This is no more the time to stop members from “rocking the boat”.
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May 01, 2008 @ 16:47:52
dr, i like your style. You are very diplomatic and you allow views from all sides. If only most bloggers out there had your attitude instead of unnecessarily being really biased to whatever party they are supporting.
This should be the place for us to explore and open our thoughts and minds. Not for others to force ideas into each others heads about which party is better and yada yada.
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May 01, 2008 @ 17:04:42
DR., you won’t be chopped. Only traitors,opportunists and hypocrites will be expelled. Luckily,Lee Kah Choon shows his colour early. I agree LKY overreacted. Don’t be distracted by the real issues and morality involved, Lee Kah Choon wanted the CM post committed to him 4 years later but when leadership turned him down,you see what is happening now. Gerakan is free and democratic.
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May 01, 2008 @ 17:11:47
It’s good to have views on all sides but to be fair to Gerakan,you must get their view also and the true story behind Lee Kah Choon and Lim Guan Eng and who are the middlemen/women who brokered the posts.Slowly and certainly,things will come out and expose all the hypocrites who abuse the term “serving the public and in the interest of the Penangites”. All bullshit if you know what went that can caused you heartache where politics has stooped so low.God save politicians.
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May 01, 2008 @ 20:43:31
dr, i knew many good friends in gerakan mostly are professional self employed sternly supporting the party. within the context of press release by the former president..as per se being a member of theparty we are not yr possession .its a free will to choose,thus outcry reflected such childishness, revengul most of all does not reflect its memberswhat would be the next direction ? reckoned the party called for a referendum , to be in or out of bn.. there s not left to hold? mca president okt just took one gambit? whats is gerakan call ?
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May 01, 2008 @ 21:06:13
Lim Keng Yaik is the man of courage, dedicated and capable man. The man have brings changes to his Bruas Parliamentary constituency. He can keep quiet and enjoy his time if he want. Gerakan still need his guidance. Gerakan will raise back and resurrection. Due respect to LKY,
A General is still a General. Many comrades will so;dier on and history will tell us whether we are right or not.
As for Lee Kah Choon, imagine he is the Deputy Secretary of Gerakan. What he had to said and explanation? Respect gained by honour.
Paradigm shift and we can forget about him. Gerakan accepted his shift of dream, direction and focus.
by changing ship.
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May 01, 2008 @ 21:31:43
Frog….In politics….every party have…good or bad motives and intentions. Thats why….not all people can become politicians….especially if their intentions are all for Malaysia Malaysians.
You single out DAP as no good party. Let me tell you this ….from the bottom of my heart. Without DAP….there is no democracy…..no equal rights for all Malaysians…….no exposing corruptions.
And I am not DAP party member..nor love everything they do or say…all these 50 years.
and I sometimes vote for BN too!!
But DAP have guts…especially Lim Kit Siang……Eng Guan and Karpal Singh….all went to jail…for the sake of Malaysians. How do you think Karpal got the nick name….’Lion of Malaysia” and keep winning in all elections…without much campaigning?
Why do you think majority Chinese support DAP…who also value so much peace and harmony?? We are smart voters…are you smart??
The difference between you…FROG….and me….is I don’t play politics….you do. I just love Malaysia and its people… more than you.
Try to think of Malaysia and Malaysians..and not about parties.
Right now…UMNO and BN dominations are weakened…to give more democratic rights to all Malaysians. Are you not happy?
And if People’s Party is one hell of bullshit people….why… we all can vote them out in next election….but why criticize them now? You mean all these 50 years…ruled by them…. so good .that millions of us ..voted against them ..are idiots??? So you like race and religion….divide and rule government by UMNO and BN….and be second class citizen? Why do you wish to sell your soul to one race?
Oh gosh!!….don’t tell me you don’t know BN are UMNO puppets on the string.
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May 01, 2008 @ 21:56:21
Bravo…pohwatchdog!!
Now that’s giving your opinions…and noted with respect. Keep it up.
Don’t belittle voters!!
And may I remind you…Lim Keng Yiak was an MCA man. He founded Gerakan…to have all races in the party….to prove Gerakan is a non racialist party.
We believed him….but they have no balls to say what they mean and mean what they say…for if they do so…..they should have pulled out from the BN. on so many occasions…they argue with UMNO for Malaysian.Chinese…..but all for show only…no guts to protect Malaysians. They could have now be stronger…as an opposition party..had they grouped up with DAP. .but Lim Keng Yiak loves to be a minister. Keng Yiak.. is just a big mouth…with no actions….like Ling Liong Sek. Lim Kit Siang could have everything he wants from UMNO…had he be like…cunning Lim Keng Yiak….do you know that?
Lee Lam Thye is the living proof!!
Gerakan…selfishness….greediness……for personal benefits….to just sit and relax…makan gaji buta…like malays…especially in PENANG…is long overdue…to be replaced by DAP. Check it out!!… people are suffering in Penang…WHY!!
So ..please give DAP a chance. It’s only one month old management…compare to 28 years by Gerakan. Not fair for voters to judge them now.
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May 01, 2008 @ 22:04:54
Don’t we got our democratic right through the ballot box? Are we that irrational, ignorant and blind?
Look at the parliamentary sitting live telecast… what
proper gentleman and ladies have debated and make. What a ignorant and emotional we are?
Are we second class citizen? Is it possible not to think as one party? Indians or Chinese or Malays
…are we really Malaysian first?
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May 01, 2008 @ 22:26:38
I am informed that the party leaders privately still object to the appointment, as they are seeing things from a pure survival perspective. They neednt have bothered. They were a dead party even before 8 March, simply becasue they have lost their way and until today, have no guts or brevity to revert back to their original ideals. For Gerakan to survive they needed to leave BN no later than 5 weeks after the elections. That deadline has come and gone, and so has any hopes of Gerakan to succeeed. We can all ‘cheng beng’ Gerakan every March/April from next year on!
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May 01, 2008 @ 22:32:55
We have frog and watchdog in this blog.
What a lively blog it is.
Lets debate..and argue..not insult People’s Party…comprising of..DAP…keDAILan…and PAS.
Millions of us WALKED IN PROTEST…without fear …for all of you….and voted for them. Look at the results.
Respect it….live with it….for next 5 years.
Don’t be poor loosers…. like UMNO and BN politicians now…finding excuses…to blame everyone…but themselves.
I don’t care two hoots what Mahathir or Dollah or UMNO guys are saying. But I do care…what MCA and Gerakan politicians and supporter are talking.
If they want a non stop propaganda …one sided nonsense..till next election..I am here to expose them.
Look at Samy…saying how shocked he was hearing Pathi died. He knew that man had terminal cancer and will die soon. Why can’t he say…he was sadden by the news. No…he said…he was shocked. This is classic example …what ..a bullshitter he is…….never sincere man..and Gerakan and MCA..have him as friend.??….why…to help Chinese??
I listen to Anwar…Eng Guan…Teresa Kok….Khalid..Kapal….Kit Siang…what they say and promises…and will give them time to deliver.
If they are proven experts to only make noises…then… 13th election. ..is not too late…to bury them alive!!
But I have the strange feeling….MCA and Gerakan are gone case parties…no more hope. 50 years never change. That’s all. We must change for the better…….and that is only possible…if all citizens are treated as Malaysians..not by dividing races.
Who do you think is guiding all of you.. to that path?? I am 69 yrs old…and never depended on government aids. I really don’t care about politics….but I love Malaysians and my country more than myself.
So folks…lets all start….loving the country more than ourselves…and debate.
…for the good… for all Malaysians…especially for the poor and middle class…not going downward…to be poorer…which they are. This is the main reason…why we need to change the government.
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May 01, 2008 @ 22:38:37
Now pohwatchdog latest message make me groggy!
But he meant well. I hope so!!
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May 01, 2008 @ 22:44:32
I meant thousands of us WALKED IN PROTEST…not millions.
Hate to make one mistake and proven to b e a liar….which I am not.
I enjoy reading Ibrahim M Phee.. another joker with a smart message.
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May 01, 2008 @ 22:54:56
Frog, leap out of your coconut shell.
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May 01, 2008 @ 23:16:16
In Malaysia, to vote any party is ones right. There is no right or wrong for evey individual to support any party. So if i have my confdent in a particular party to serve the nation well, i will vote for that party. But at times it is not that party that i am not happy with but the candidate that rep the party. Lets say for eg, MP form a particular state who had not shown any wisdom in presentig or representing our needs in Parliment but only good at stupid remarsk like bochor , making fun of women with sexiest remarks, i will says go to hell with this man who has no quality in him. So it will not make sens for me to consider his party cos, his party should know how incapable of him to carry out his duty. So, i will vote the next best or should say now the best.
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May 01, 2008 @ 23:33:12
lky interWhen he left and said he was a loyal Gerakan member […] he was pressed by
(Penang CM) Lim Guan Eng to resign or not. When he resigned as a member,
that’s when I blasted him (laughs). When he said “I am a loyal Gerakan
member but I’m only doing my job”, I said “I pity you”. When he left I knew
“Ah, you are opportunistic – you are more interested in the position rather
than being loyal to the party”.
If he had the brevity to discuss with the party leadership, they would
(have) most probably agreed with him to take up the post. If he had briefed
us, we would have had a hard time seeing this so-called new paradigm shift
as espoused by the ‘great’ Lim Guan Eng. This fellow is more cunning than
his father. Come on we’re not a matured democracy yet. There is no two-party
system yet lah. This new paradigm shift is a political ploy by Guan Eng.
Not only Kah Choon, if you go to Perak there are going to be 500 councillors
leaving and DAP can go find their councillors who can perform. You have to
poach but in the (elections) you won, you go and deliver lah. Why you poach
our people to do the job for you?
That Kah Choon, I know what he told me. Five days after the March 8
election, we had a one-to-one dinner and what did he propose to me? Totally
different from what he’s doing now. Am I not angry? I trained him, I brought
him up. I went against (former premier) Mahathir’s decision in 1999 by
putting him up as a candidate in Jelutong.view ..gosh…….read it yrsself ! this is one great old man…havent we not learn from history?
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May 01, 2008 @ 23:35:42
I am sick with the ‘cultural’ and ‘mentality’ of BN leaders. These BN ‘Greats’ like TDM, SV, LKY were stayed too long in their laurels and it is very hard to change their ‘cultural’ and ‘mentality’.
The unfortunate thing here is many Malaysians, to a certain extent, were influenced by these so-called ‘Greats’ until to the believe that whatever opposite camp do or suggest are all wrong and should not be supported. This is exactly what we see in Gerakan, Umno, MCA, MIC.
Just hope that LKY won’t sabotage Lim Guan Eng government as he said “Thank you very much, I am retired”, adding in jest, “I’ll sabotage them.” when was asked whether he would sabotage Lim Guan Eng. If he sabotages, then we really ‘Mou Gan Tai’.
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May 01, 2008 @ 23:37:53
If Pakatan asks you for help, would you assist?
Thank you very much, I am retired. I’ll sabotage them (laughs).
that is statement of a year…..sour grapes ! well perhaps fellow commentors would like to take a dip ?
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May 01, 2008 @ 23:39:32
watch out once u are gerakan member yr soul belong to them.even yr wives and children it seemed?wow thats fun ya ~
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May 02, 2008 @ 00:28:10
Feel like I’m reading an obituary message on Gerakan.
Please R.I.P. You have tormented us long enough! You have had your share of glories and lot of fun enjoying your spoils, now I beg you not to come back and haunt us again.
May the lord have mercy on your soul. Amen!!
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May 02, 2008 @ 02:05:19
Guys,
I had dinner with an old friend who happens to be a PR chap tonight and by his own account, all is not so rosy after all in Penang.
The problem is the lack of capable manpower to fill the numerous committees and sub-committees and so on.
Effectively, they are stretched thin. As he put it, their problem is the lack of depth within the parties of PR.
The top few of each party are capable but can’t find many capable lieutenants to delegate to.
They are fully aware that there are many within their ranks clamoring for these positions but are also distrustful of these people since they don’t want to create debacles for the public to chastise them.
Which brings me back to the LKC issue.
I think it is good strategy on Guan Eng’s part to appoint LKC. It serves many purposes and is extremely good politics and a win-win situation all the way round.
They know if they don’t appoint LKC or people like him, then they are forced to appoint unknown and untested characters from within PR which could end up giving them a public relations disaster.
Whether Gerakan accepts the appointment or not, they would have been seen to reach across the political divide for the betterment of Penang and would have endeared Penang people to them.
If LKC succeeds, all well and fine, and all credit will go to PR and further endear Penangites to them for their foresight.
If LKC fails, no damage done to PR as they would have been seen as having tried their best and can’t be faulted. They would have also bought enough time to train someone from within to take over.
Had they appointed someone from within their ranks right from the start and had he failed, Penangites would surely have questioned their ability and saw the stark reality of their inexperience.
My hats off to Lim Guan Eng and his strategists for this brilliant move. This is what I call thinking out of the box.
As for LKY kicking up such a fuss, he is only putting the whole party into a no-win situation. Very poor strategy in this cut-throat political game.
He is also not helping the current leadership with his outbursts. The less he opens his mouth the better for all concerned.
Unfortunately, by objecting to LKC’s appointment on political grounds, Gerakan is seen as being selfish and not interested for the general good of Penang if it affects the party.
Now if LKC succeeds, Gerakan can’t claim any credit for it and if LKC fails, Gerakan would be seen as having had a hand in his failure.
Very stupid of LKY to put himself and the party in such an awkward situation.
I wonder who the strategist of Gerakan’s leadership are? Its amazing a party of such resources can’t employ or recruit better strategists. Or are the leaders so egoistic that they know better than the strategists?
I know for a fact that KTK did recruit some high-calibre Penangites sometime back. Some of these people were involved in past US presidential campaigns, working for private enterprises engaged by presidential candidates.
I wonder where they are now or have their voices been drowned out by those who surround KTK for selfish reasons?
I think there is still a possibility of Gerakan regaining its relevance if only it can plan its strategies in accordance with its needs right now and recognize where its ‘niche’ audience is now.
Forget the past, what it has done in the past counts for nothing if it cannot adapt to what the voting rakyat wants now.
To the leadership who are reading this, let me remind you that the ‘middle-ground’ is both big and wide and there are no claimants to it yet.
Capture it and it might just ensure your relevance and Gerakan’s survival.
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May 02, 2008 @ 03:33:19
pohwatchdog,
Bring changes to Beruas constituency… have you been to the “Beruas” constituency ??
I’m grew up in that constituency and for decades, we have been trying to get a permit to build a bigger Church, on our own land and our own money, behind the existing Church, as our members have grown and the existing Church no longer able to accomodate all, to the point we have to do it Sundays in 2 sessions.
What have changed in decades under Mr Saliva Machine-gun mouth ?
At least now, we have a new State Exco position for Non-Muslims under YB Ngeh who represents Beruas no, and I’m pretty sure changes will happen soon.
Indeed, they have given the New Villages more in 50-days than BN have ever did in 50 years.
Dr Hsu,
My salute to you to bringing out the real feedback from the grassroot. It is the arrogance of the leadership that the grassroot rejects…. but still, they want to stay in their own fantasy world…
We still have much respects for Gerakan of olden days, and many still reminisce the Lim Chong Eu days.
Lim Keng Yaik is really very low class compared to Lim Chong Eu, their similarity is only in the surname.
Imagine right after the 8th March election, he had the audacity to launch his tirades of accusation against YB Ngeh and YB Nga, that they are greedy for money and power, in front of a group of teachers (who have no choice but to sit through the official function).
Let me tell you how YB Ngeh’s campaign works, it is all uncle and aunties volunteering to help put up their posters. This time around the Indians came out in drove to do it for free, when in the past, some of them do ask for money to help in putting up posters.
How to fight against the well funded BN machinery who floods our street with blue…. but yet DAP won… and PAS and Indians came all out to support them… it was just phenomenal that it cuts across racial and religious lines.
YB Ngeh is one of the most pious guy I have met, despite running his already succesful Law firm, he still finds time every week to help be translator in our Church, and every time without fail, have donated generously in most events.
He is from humble background, with rubber tapper parents, yet although he is a self-made man from his own Law firm, still live very modestly in small town Ayer Tawar.
He does not need to get rich by being politicians, he contested and lost 3 times successively in the past, using his own money and despite his family asking him to give up, but he never gave up due to his conviction to fight for justice.
We are blessed indeed that finally “Beruas” have a decent representative from the Rakyat.
I am glad that Gerakan has grassroot members such as Dr Hsu…. please help eliminate the political patronage that is killing Gerakan.
Do the right thing for Gerakan in the coming election.
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May 02, 2008 @ 09:03:56
Don’t judge the book by his cover. Let time tell us. What have we see in Perak Pakatan Rakyat coalition? Look what Pakatan Rakyat have done.
Claiming credit from unknown reason especially the previous MP’s works.. Are you sure DAP are not well fund? Of course … been to Beruas and throughout of Perak.
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May 02, 2008 @ 09:08:55
Correct u Monsterball. Gerakan is founded by Syed Hussein Al Alatas, Tan Chee Khoon, V. David, Lee Chong Eu, Wang Gung Wu and a group of intellectual. Still believe GERAKAN ideology for a fair and just society. Gerakan needed more courage and dedicated leaders. We shall return as quoted by General Douglas MacArthur.
Whereas…. Pakatan Rakyat have his own weakness. Political honeymoon is over. Let start work and what changes being brought to the states. Don’t pass the bucks and blaming others.
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May 02, 2008 @ 09:44:21
Interesting to read all the intellectual input and arguement.
“We shall return” as what?? another round as whipping boys of UMNO. Sitting at a coffee shop in Medan Trengganu, one would hear ,gong lang bo liaw or the mad man no more.
We have been on the receiving end far too long and made to look subservient. Our present generation of youngsters have felt the idiotic act of BN and have felt sidelined, some psychologically wreck, how do one feel when their see their own childre in this manner.
In the same coffee shop, an elderly man with tears in his eyes related how his grandson behaved, a high achiever but was restricted. Emotions were high at that table and curses were thrown around.
Lets have fair governance and Lee Guan Eng is trying to make it so in Penang. Say what one likes on LKS and LGE but they have spoken up and fought for our rights to have our rightful place in this society.
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May 02, 2008 @ 11:22:54
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May 02, 2008 @ 12:10:55
Mr pohwatchdog,
I don’t judge YB Ngeh and YB Nga by their cover, I practically grow up with them, they are my Church members and are the most active volunteers.
There is no money or fame to be had.
We just want a better future for our children….
a future which Gerakan in its heydays champion for us…
But have since TOTALLY LOST their ways and become part of the Barua Nasional..
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May 02, 2008 @ 12:37:37
In the coming elections, can you guys do one thing good for Gerakan… if it is to remain relevant.
Please bring back the intellectuals and the ideals of your founding members.
Don’t vote in leaders who can only kiss UMNO’s ass.
Unfortunately, I don’t see many in the current line up who can fulfill that criteria. Most are LKY’s cronies.
You need a TOTAL REINVENT !!
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May 02, 2008 @ 14:53:27
yes pohwatchdog…I was wrong….Gerakan was founded by those people…you mentioned….thanks!
But Lim Keng Yiak is the person..that made the party popular…..with his excellent bullshits….and balls carrying Mahathir.
I am reading others comment….and want to add…MCA and Gerakan days are numbered.
Judgement Day…was 8th March 2008!!
There is no turning back. It leaves only to… People’s Party…to mess it up.
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May 02, 2008 @ 14:55:17
I mean…”to mess themselves up” in my last sentence.
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May 02, 2008 @ 21:49:53
This post was posted in Malaysia today, around the blogs corner, and there are many more comments there.
http://www.malaysia-today.net/2008/content/view/6917/84/
One of The previous posts, the Ball is at Gerakan foot, was also similarly listed a week ago. Thanks to RPK.
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May 03, 2008 @ 21:50:55
Petestop, why not go to perakkini@multiply.com for latest information about your good childhood friend.
Do you really think PR have the credibility in Perak? Even discard his political secretary for umpteen years. What action have been done to poach others in Perak?
Busy putting blame syndrome and claiming previous MP’s credit. Look around and list out the weakness. What a group of cats busying clawing at each other? What qualities of changes been done even opportunities at door step? Faces yet to been seen. Busying counting gains.
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May 06, 2008 @ 05:06:34
Why not you shut up and stop talking nonsense…..pohwatchdog.
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